Did anything come of that Closes artwork discovery?

[Gates Of Horn And Ivory]

Boc Maxima was never commercially released either. If any of the pre-Twoism albums were released outside of family and friends, we would have heard about them by now. As for the original artwork, I would imagine it looks something like the Old Tunes tapes.

You're thinking that BOC made 50-100 copies each of several albums intended only for their friends, and then later "reissued" the same albums in other formats, in similar quantities, again just for their friends.

[tonx]

Boc Maxima was never commercially released either. If any of the pre-Twoism albums were released outside of family and friends, we would have heard about them by now. As for the original artwork, I would imagine it looks something like the Old Tunes tapes.

You're thinking that BOC made 50-100 copies each of several albums intended only for their friends, and then later "reissued" the same albums in other formats, in similar quantities, again just for their friends.

People keep talking about these family and friends releases as though there was already some teeming horde of fans wanting to hear their stuff or record shops wishing they had more cuts from that hit label Music70 to fill their shelves. These releases were small because they were unknowns, not because they never wanted them heard.

Which brings me back around to the notion that we ought to establish a bounty for a verifiable release/leak of any of those tapes/CDs -- which short of the brothers pulling an Aphex Twin and dumping them on soundcloud, is likely the only way we'll ever hear them. A complete BoC Set would be too much work, even without factoring in the insane sample clearances they'd have to chase down.

[THE BOB]

you could ask these guys:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtfX3bV1MWQ

[North by North]

The ending notes of the music in that video always made me wonder if it was a friend of "Olson". Obviously we have no clue if it was BOC, and I doubt Mike P. would even leak 6 seconds of old unreleased audio. Probably made it themselves to fuck with people. But I still wonder, and will very likely never know.

[Skimming Stone]

Mdg also stated in a PM at one point that the original cassettes had no artwork

This information should probably be added to Bocpages

[drillkicker]

The ending notes of the music in that video always made me wonder if it was a friend of "Olson". Obviously we have no clue if it was BOC, and I doubt Mike P. would even leak 6 seconds of old unreleased audio. Probably made it themselves to fuck with people. But I still wonder, and will very likely never know.

It could just be one of Mike P's old unreleased tracks of which he has many.

[Techboy]

I remember the Sellik Tap from primary school so it's maybe 98 or 99 onwards. Dates it after alleged release date - anyone bored enough to try and date any other stuff? Might make it provably post 1997 then we can finally stop getting shit tonnes of posts asking for these releases that for all we know, might not even exist. Evidence would be a fine thing.

[Cupz]

Good point, I hereby declare everything pre-twoism non-existent untill proven otherwise.

[flowerbeast]

Good point, I hereby declare everything pre-twoism non-existent untill proven otherwise.

[Opothecary]

The pictures taken were dated 8/16 - 8/17 of 1997. It's obviously CD shaped artwork, it was supposedly pressed to CD in 1997...it's all pretty cut and dry.

[blendo75]

I just wanted to add, just in case anyone doesnt know, that during the Paradinas Old Tunes tape selling "scandal", it was 99.9% confirmed that Paradinas indeed does own other unreleased BOC tapes such as Closes. His wife, who was facilitating the sale of the Old Tunes tapes said that they have other old releases as well but wouldnt be selling them because they werent already freely available on the net.

"Mike does have other unreleased stuff but he wont sell those because they havent been out there in the public domain"

Personally I have no doubt that these tapes exist. Many of my favorite artists have similar unreleased cassette-based material floating around from before they made it big. You should see Beck's unreleased tape collection, it's immense and for years people kept finding new tapes that no one knew existed. Some of these tapes are extremely rare but they were actual public releases. If you were in the right place at the right time you could've bought one at a Beck show at a coffee shop or bar or whatever.

The fact that BOC cared enough about these old releases to acknowledge their existence and give us tidbits of info about them tells me that they are a similar type of public release, or are at least considered important parts of their evolution and legacy. The stuff they DIDNT show us, like the Old Tunes tapes, are most likely compilations of this material that they didnt consider an official release, if that makes sense. If anything was made for "friends and family" it would've been the Old Tunes stuff, which has always struck me as a best-of comps / record label demo tapes. Closes is not a demo tape, it's as much of a "real album" as Harvest. Just because it's rare doesnt mean it's friends-only or was never meant to be heard. When it was made it could very well have been the apex of all things BOC and they were incredibly proud of it and shared it with anyone and everyone who would listen!

To summarize: Closes, Acid Memories, etc. are official BOC albums that are real, were publicly released (as much as resources would allow) and are EXTREMELY rare. Old Tunes are compilations of these albums that were meant for friends/family/scenesters/record labels, which is why we've actually gotten to hear this stuff, because of all their old material this probably got the widest release and was released closest to the time where they were getting world-wide popularity.

[Omikron]

I just wanted to add, just in case anyone doesnt know, that during the Paradinas Old Tunes tape selling "scandal", it was 99.9% confirmed that Paradinas indeed does own other unreleased BOC tapes such as Closes. His wife, who was facilitating the sale of the Old Tunes tapes said that they have other old releases as well but wouldnt be selling them because they werent already freely available on the net.

"Mike does have other unreleased stuff but he wont sell those because they havent been out there in the public domain"

Personally I have no doubt that these tapes exist. Many of my favorite artists have similar unreleased cassette-based material floating around from before they made it big. You should see Beck's unreleased tape collection, it's immense and for years people kept finding new tapes that no one knew existed. Some of these tapes are extremely rare but they were actual public releases. If you were in the right place at the right time you could've bought one at a Beck show at a coffee shop or bar or whatever.

The fact that BOC cared enough about these old releases to acknowledge their existence and give us tidbits of info about them tells me that they are a similar type of public release, or are at least considered important parts of their evolution and legacy. The stuff they DIDNT show us, like the Old Tunes tapes, are most likely compilations of this material that they didnt consider an official release, if that makes sense. If anything was made for "friends and family" it would've been the Old Tunes stuff, which has always struck me as a best-of comps / record label demo tapes. Closes is not a demo tape, it's as much of a "real album" as Harvest. Just because it's rare doesnt mean it's friends-only or was never meant to be heard. When it was made it could very well have been the apex of all things BOC and they were incredibly proud of it and shared it with anyone and everyone who would listen!

To summarize: Closes, Acid Memories, etc. are official BOC albums that are real, were publicly released (as much as resources would allow) and are EXTREMELY rare. Old Tunes are compilations of these albums that were meant for friends/family/scenesters/record labels, which is why we've actually gotten to hear this stuff, because of all their old material this probably got the widest release and was released closest to the time where they were getting world-wide popularity.

I agree that those releases certainly exist, but I disagree that they were given out to anyone who did not personally know the brothers and/or the Hexagon Sun crew.

In an interview, Mike and Marcus talked about how the unreleased tapes were only given to close friends and family whom they completely trusted to never share them.

Clearly you haven't read this particular interview (it's quite hard to find and it's not in English) because it not only confirms that the albums in question exist but also that they were never publicly released.

[blendo75]

I've never read it but I'm aware the brothers have made the "never publicly released" statement. It's not that I dont believe them, I just disagree with what "publicly released" means. Even if a particular release was only given to HS crew members... 100 copies seems a lot, and then a re-release on CD.. how many HS crew and/or friends and family do they have? Why do a re-release? Wasnt Twoism also a supposedly private release? So how did it end up landing them a recording contract? These questions have kept me up late, searching, many nights. I'll be very relieved if/when all this old stuff gets released.

[Opothecary]

I sort of tend to agree with blendo75, but with some big caveats. I end up rehashing my feelings on the unreleased stuff occasionally, I guess it's time again now that things seem to be heating up again.

I feel that Play By Numbers is the only one to have had an actual local limited release. It's the only one that was pressed to CD on its supposed initial release, there's a couple anecdotes of people having recognized the artwork from the local record stores, and according to interviews, it was the first time they used the name Boards of Canada (I think they said 1994, not this specific release, so its reading between the lines) at that point, they were probably just now making a go at being a shoegaze band, the stuff they'd doodled around with and put on Catalog 3/Acid Memories/Closes Vol 1 was totally different.

Hooper Bay seems like it was probably a dry run for Twoism, it was supposedly pressed to vinyl as well. Maybe they didn't like how it turned out. Maybe they didn't have confidence in their sound yet - its a total 180 from what they were just doing and I'm sure it was back to just the Sandisons at this point, maybe Chris Horne too. The decision to change it up so much is really interesting to me. Did they eat some acid, start listening to SAW2 and decide to watch that tape of Sesame Street that turned into such a goldmine of samples? Anyways, vinyl seems like the largest commitment, format-wise so it seems weird to press it to vinyl and then do nothing with it. Maybe a few copies did go out to local shops, who knows. Twoism was distributed on vinyl to members of a mailing list and that's how it became known, so its weird that they committed to vinyl for Hooper Bay but made no attempt to distribute it.

Maxima and Old Tunes were sent out as demos to record labels and given to friends and family as well. The reason they leaked was because it wasn't just friends and family in this case. The former was a more developed picture of their modern work, Old Tunes is likely the less developed sketches that were a mix of things made prior and after Play By Numbers that didn't get onto any of those supposed "proper" releases. It's hard to tell what was made when, since PBN is really just an aberration in their catalog. They went back to making the same type of music, albeit better written and with more of their trademark flourishes now in place, so I feel they just mixed together the stuff that was contemporary but didn't make the cut for Maxima along with some of their other old music.

My theory on R35TT is still that its a compilation of the best and most consistent work from those "proper" unreleased tapes. It's Goldilocks, it's just right. Old Tunes veers erratically from juvenile ephemera to mind blowing stuff like Boqurant/5.9.78, Kiteracer 2 and I Will Get it Tattooed but R35TT is just all killer no filler. It's somehow more developed than most of the OT but also more primitive at the same time. Very hard to explain for me but its fantastic.

With regard to Catalog 3/Acid Memories/Closes Vol. 1 and the associated artwork "controversy", I think it's really simple. These things were just simple handmade cassettes along the lines of the OT prior to 1997. Their website in 1998 only listed Acid Memories, Play By Numbers and Hooper Bay. No reference to any CD releases other than Play By Numbers. However, Acid Memories did have its CD shaped artwork and "Boards of Canada" titling (whose name did not exist when it was supposedly created) at that time so its safe to assume that Acid Memories was put to CD at the same time as the others, it just didn't say anything about it in the entry. Maybe a year later, Catalog 3 and Closes Vol 1 were added to the website, along with a note about their CD reissue in 1997. Basically, my thought is that in 1997, they pressed (burned?) all 3 of them to CD, gave them proper covers, had a Red Moon party to celebrate signing to Warp and handed them out to friends, never to be sold in a store. The end.

[tonx]

Three things:

1) I love these sorts of discussions.

2) I'm still of the mind that the "friends and family" issue, at least for many/most of these releases, is less an issue of them wanting them to remain underground (at least at the time they were made) than of not having much of audience.

3) I reiterate my commitment to a $500 contribution to the bounty for each/any rip/leak of Closes, PBN, Hooper Bay, Acid Memories, Cat 3. Leave a bitcoin address in the ID3 tag and we're golden.

[mr3]

Part of me wonders if R35TT would sound different if we knew who put it together...my mind puts that right up there next to what it might be like to hear the mostly unheard stuff. At the same time, its lasting awesomeness still holds me over pretty well in the meantime.

[Tarkus]

Speaking of unreleased material, I wonder how many cut tracks there actually were for each album. They said in the past there's a lot of unreleased material for Geogaddi.

[blendo75]

Sorry to resurrect such an old thread but I wanted to correct myself here. I misinterpreted what Rix-Martin was saying, clearly the "unreleased tapes" she was talking about were from other artists, not BoC. Paradinas just confirmed that he does not and never has owned Play by Numbers, Hooper Bay, etc. and in fact he doubts they exist at all.

https://www.reddit.com/r/boardsofcanada ... paradinas/

[WATER_CAN-_-]

He should have just said that he doesn't know instead of spreading misinformation. Because he doesn't know.

[ParticleGhost]

Arguing over what may be a 25 year old prank is serious business!